S01E12 A Strong Culture is Like a Cult, with Verne Harnish
Download MP3“Is it companies who put employees first? Do they perform better than companies who put customers first? Or those that put stakeholders first?. I thought it was a fundamental question needed to be answered. And the answer [the came through John Kotter’s research] surprised everybody… The companies that outperformed by a factor of 10 were those that treated all 3 equally. That the employees, customers, and shareholders were all like a 3-legged stool.”
S01E12 of the Rethink Culture podcast shines the spotlight on Verne Harnish, founder of the world-renowned Entrepreneurs’ Organization (EO) with 18,000 members globally, and CEO of Scaling Up, a global executive education and coaching company, and author of several books, including Mastering the Rockefeller Habits, and Scaling Up Compensation.
Listen to find out:
- how would Verne write a book about culture and its first three chapters
- why every company is strange, as it tries to align its particular culture with the people that fit it.
- why you shouldn’t try to mess with the culture of an organisation after the first 5 years
- why we need to replace the word leadership with the word “careship”
- why people don’t want to be managed or led, but coached.
- why language is a key component of a culture
Further references:
- Verne Harnish on Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/verneharnish/
- Scaling Up: https://scalingup.com/
- Entrepreneurs Organization (EO): https://growth.eonetwork.org/
Books referenced:
- “Change to Strange: Create a Great Organization by Building a Strange Workforce” by Daniel M. Cable: https://www.amazon.com/Change-Strange-Organization-Building-Workforce/dp/0131572229
- “Scaling Up: How a Few Companies Make It...and Why the Rest Don't” by Verne Harnish: https://www.amazon.com/Scaling-Up-Companies-Rockefeller-Habits/dp/0986019526
- “Corporate Culture and Performance” by John P. Kotter and James L. Heskett: https://www.amazon.com/Corporate-Culture-Performance-John-Kotter/dp/1451655320
- Culture Renovation: 18 Leadership Actions to Build an Unshakeable Company by Kevin Oakes https://www.amazon.com/Culture-Renovation-Leadership-Actions-Unshakeable/dp/1260464369
- The Heart of Business: Leadership Principles for the Next Era of Capitalism by Hubert Joly https://www.amazon.com/Heart-Business-Leadership-Principles-Capitalism/dp/B09156FL17/ref=sr_1_1?crid=E77JU5VTTTZH
- “Scrum: The Art of Doing Twice the Work in Half the Time” by Jeff Sutherland and J.J. Sutherland: https://www.amazon.com/Scrum-Doing-Twice-Work-Half/dp/038534645X
- “Elon Musk” by Walter Isaacson: https://www.amazon.com/Elon-Musk-Walter-Isaacson/dp/1982181281
S01E12 of the Rethink Culture podcast shines the spotlight on Verne Harnish, founder of the world-renowned Entrepreneurs’ Organization (EO) with 18,000 members globally, and CEO of Scaling Up, a global executive education and coaching company, and author of several books, including Mastering the Rockefeller Habits, and Scaling Up Compensation.
Listen to find out:
- how would Verne write a book about culture and its first three chapters
- why every company is strange, as it tries to align its particular culture with the people that fit it.
- why you shouldn’t try to mess with the culture of an organisation after the first 5 years
- why we need to replace the word leadership with the word “careship”
- why people don’t want to be managed or led, but coached.
- why language is a key component of a culture
Further references:
- Verne Harnish on Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/verneharnish/
- Scaling Up: https://scalingup.com/
- Entrepreneurs Organization (EO): https://growth.eonetwork.org/
Books referenced:
- “Change to Strange: Create a Great Organization by Building a Strange Workforce” by Daniel M. Cable: https://www.amazon.com/Change-Strange-Organization-Building-Workforce/dp/0131572229
- “Scaling Up: How a Few Companies Make It...and Why the Rest Don't” by Verne Harnish: https://www.amazon.com/Scaling-Up-Companies-Rockefeller-Habits/dp/0986019526
- “Corporate Culture and Performance” by John P. Kotter and James L. Heskett: https://www.amazon.com/Corporate-Culture-Performance-John-Kotter/dp/1451655320
- Culture Renovation: 18 Leadership Actions to Build an Unshakeable Company by Kevin Oakes https://www.amazon.com/Culture-Renovation-Leadership-Actions-Unshakeable/dp/1260464369
- The Heart of Business: Leadership Principles for the Next Era of Capitalism by Hubert Joly https://www.amazon.com/Heart-Business-Leadership-Principles-Capitalism/dp/B09156FL17/ref=sr_1_1?crid=E77JU5VTTTZH
- “Scrum: The Art of Doing Twice the Work in Half the Time” by Jeff Sutherland and J.J. Sutherland: https://www.amazon.com/Scrum-Doing-Twice-Work-Half/dp/038534645X
- “Elon Musk” by Walter Isaacson: https://www.amazon.com/Elon-Musk-Walter-Isaacson/dp/1982181281
Creators and Guests

Guest
Verne Harnish
Verne Harnish is a world-leading expert, speaker, author, and entrepreneur in the field of business growth. He has spent more than 30 years educating entrepreneurial teams. As part of his personal mission to support entrepreneurs, he co-founded Growth Institute, a premier online training company that has helped mid-market companies in over 50 countries learn and implement the latest business methodologies. He also founded the world-renowned Entrepreneurs' Organization (EO) and chaired for 15 years EO's premier CEO program, the "Birthing of Giants", held at MIT. Verne is also the Founder and CEO of Scaling Up, a global executive education and coaching company with over 180 partners on six continents, Known as the "Growth Guy" syndicated columnist, Verne is also a regular columnist for Fortune magazine. He's the author of Scaling Up, Mastering the Rockefeller Habits and, along with the editors of Fortune, authored The Greatest Business Decisions of All Time, for which Jim Collins wrote the foreword. With his expertise in high demand, Verne chairs annual Growth Summits in North America, Europe, and Asia and continues to teach in the MIT-based executive program he founded. He is also a private investor in many scaleups. Verne is a father of four who enjoys piano, tennis, and magic as a card-carrying member of the International Brotherhood of Magicians.
